Has God’s plan for our Redemption Failed?

Commentary By:  Gordon King

Yesterday I wrote a rather lengthy post about our salvation, partly because I was challenged and partly because I was condemned for believing that we cannot lose our salvation.  Actually I stopped where I did not because I didn’t have more to say, but because I had to stop somewhere.  I was basically told that I was teaching a “damnable doctrine”!   I am very passionate about my salvation and I do not take lightly being accused of preaching a false doctrine when I know that it is the truth!  I know it from scripture, but I also know it from personal experience with my Savior Jesus Christ!  I know for a fact that I have been saved, yet I have sinned, I walked away from God for a while, yet I came back, did God ever forsake me?  No!  How then do I know that I am saved?  Because I have  personal experiences with God, He has touched me in ways that only He can, done things in my life that only He can.  He turned a miserable wretch into one of His own, a child of God seeking to please Him.

We must all be very careful not to condemn other believers in Christ, especially if what we are accusing the other of is not true.  If we condemn a believer for something that God Himself says is the truth then we are accusing God, we are saying that God is giving us damnable doctrine!

The question of whether or not we can lose our salvation is very important and it should be to “all” believers in Jesus Christ!  It is here that we place our entire faith, it is here that we trust that the good Lord has the ability to save us from our sins, to save us from eternal damnation!  And if God cannot save us from all of our sins has His plan for redemption then failed?!  Was the death of Jesus Christ on the cross and His resurrection into heaven not enough to pay our debt?  Are we then saying that Jesus does not have the power to save us from hell?

Let’s just take a deep breath and stop for a moment.  What is the bible really all about anyway?  It’s the story of God’s love, the love of God for His creation, man (and woman), human beings.  It’s a story of God’s redemption for man, to save us from our sins, from our rebellion against Him.  It’s also a story of how He will pour out His wrath upon those who are unsaved, of what is in store for those that choose not to believe.  This is basically it in a nutshell.

The bible is full of verses telling us that we must repent of our sins and believe in Jesus Christ, then we will be saved, scripture tells us this over and over again.  We must rightly divide the word of God, we must understand what it is that God is telling us, yet we shall never fully understand all of it in this life time, but it is ours to try and do so, this is growing and maturing in the Lord.

I was told recently by a commenter that God knows who will be saved and who won’t, that all believers have been predestined to be saved, of course I already knew this, but he makes a good point.  There are many so-called believers who are not truly saved, yet they believe that they are and many of us believe that they are as well.  And scripture tells us that some of us will fall away crucifying Christ over again.  I believe that it is these “so-called” believers that scripture is talking about, not truly saved Christians.

If we are truly saved then we have God within us, and it is He who changes us from the inside, not us.  It is He who leads us and guides us and keeps us from temptation, it is He who justifies us by our faith.  And it is our faith that gives us the ability to perform God’s will, and it is God’s will for us to do so.

Much of the written word of God is given to us not out of fear, but out of love, in order to encourage us and in order to build our faith in God!  If we have fear then we cannot perform God’s will, on the other hand with faith we can rest assured that when we are saved we are always saved, that God has given us eternal life, that it is He who has done these things not us or none of us would have been saved in the first place!  This should give us more faith, the faith to do what we are here to do, God’s will!  If we have to worry about whether or not we will lose our salvation then how can we focus in on God’s will?

God has saved us not to give us fear and worry, not so that we would have no hope, just the opposite is true, He has given us a hope for eternity, the hope is an anchor of our soul, it is sure (certainty, having no doubt) and steadfast (resolutely or dutifully firm and unwavering), which means that we can take it to the bank, that what God has done for us is true and we can count on it, this means our eternal salvation!

Hebrews 6:19

This hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and steadfast, and which enters the Presence behind the veil,

The apostle Paul was writing to the Hebrews, yet these words also hold true for all believers in Jesus Christ.  Notice the last verse in Hebrews 8:12, “their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more”.

Hebrews 8:10-12

For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 11 None of them shall teach his neighbor, and none his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them. 12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.

The New testament was written so that believers in Jesus Christ would know the truth from lies, so that we would have a guide-book to lead us through this life and into eternity.  It was written to encourage us, to build our faith, and to keep us from temptation.

We as believers have been justified by God through our faith, and it is by God’s will that we have been sanctified through Jesus Christ, “once for all”.

Hebrews 10:8-10

Previously saying, “Sacrifice and offering, burnt offerings, and offerings for sin You did not desire, nor had pleasure in them” (which are offered according to the law), then He said, “Behold, I have come to do Your will, O God.” He takes away the first that He may establish the second. 10 By that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Hebrews 10:14

For by one offering He has perfected forever those who are being sanctified.

Forever is a very long time!  Those who are saved are justified, sanctified, and glorified by God!

In the old covenant priests gave regular sacrifices to God, why?  Because the blood of animals was not enough to cover our sins, they did not cover old sins nor did they cover future sins.  However, Jesus Christ came to do away with the old covenant, He came to do away with all sins!  His blood was enough to cover past sins, present sins, and future sins, once for all!

Hebrews 10:17-18

then He adds, “Their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.” 18 Now where there is remission of these, there is no longer an offering for sin.

Remission is defined as “the cancellation of a debt, charge, or penalty”.  And if there is no longer an offering for sin, that means that Jesus Christ paid it all!  There is remission of sins for the true believer in Jesus Christ.

Hebrews 10:19

Therefore, brothers, since we have confidence to enter the holy places by the blood of Jesus, 20 by the new and living way that he opened for us through the curtain, that is, through his flesh, 21 and since we have a great priest over the house of God, 22 let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, with our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. 23 Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for he who promised is faithful. 24 And let us consider how to stir up one another to love and good works, 25 not neglecting to meet together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging one another, and all the more as you see the Day drawing near.

This is the assurance of our faith, the confidence to enter the holy places by the blood of Jesus.  It is encouragement for the soul.  We are told to “hold fast” (remain tightly secured) the confession of our hope without wavering, for he who promised is faithful.  If we are not sure of our salvation, then how in the world can we hold fast without wavering?  We are to continue encouraging one another and even more as the Day draws near.  What day is that?  The Day of Christ!

Hebrews 10:26-29 is often used to prove that a believer can lose his or her salvation.  But, I do not believe that this is rightly dividing the world of God!

Hebrews 10:26-29

For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has set aside the law of Moses dies without mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses. 29 How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has trampled underfoot the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace?”

I believe that these verses are referring to unbelievers who have heard the word of God yet turn from it and continue in sin.  They have rejected the gospel of Christ, hence verse 28 speaking about the law of Moses, the unbelievers.  Also we must continue to read to the end of Hebrews chapter 10, verse 39 to fully understand who Paul is talking about here.

Hebrews 10-39

But we are not of those who shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who have faith and preserve their souls.

This verse tells us that these are not believers who shrink back but unbelievers!

Did all of the apostles really know Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior?  No, Judas Iscariot didn’t!

John 6:70-71

Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you, the twelve, and one of you is a devil?” 71 He spoke of Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon, for it was he who would betray Him, being one of the twelve.

My point is that all who say that they are Christians are not really true Christians, not all are saved, and much of scripture is speaking about these people when referring to those who know the truth yet fall away from it, just as with Judas Iscariot.

Our Father in heaven knows who are His, He knew before the creation of the world, and He predestined us to be saved for all of eternity!  And Jesus Christ our Shepherd, He knows who belongs to Him, and He will not lose one soul that belongs to Him!

John 6:35-40

 Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me shall never thirst. 36 But I said to you that you have seen me and yet do not believe. 37 All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out. 38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me. 39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. 40 For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”

Jesus said that whomever comes to Him He will never cast out!  He will lose nothing that the Father has given Him but raise it up on the last day!  This includes all true believers in Jesus Christ!  All who believe in the Son shall have eternal life and be raised up on the last day!

How could any believer in Jesus Christ believe that we could lose our salvation when Jesus Himself told us that this would not happen?!  Jesus gave us His word, His promise.  Our Father in heaven who has predestined those to be saved will come to Christ, and Christ will never let them go!  Never!

Has God’s plan for our redemption failed?  Never!  God’s plan for our redemption is working just as planned, no side tracks, no slip ups, no mistakes about it!  Read and study the word of God, meditate upon it, ask the good Lord for wisdom and enlightenment and He will surely give it to you!

God bless my friends!  Maranatha!

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18 comments

  1. Eliot Lugo

    One of the issues with any view on any doctrine we have believed, is that we often look at verses that seem to strongly support our views ignoring, at the same time, other verses that contradict (implicitly or explicitly) our views. Let me express some statements to prove my point.

    • The Bible does not teach Trinitarian doctrine AND Unitarian doctrine at the same time.
    • The Bible does not teach Pre-Tribulation AND Post-Tribulation Rapture.
    • The Bible does not teach Jesus is divine AND is not divine.
    • The Bible does not teach that all Christians speak in unknown tongues AND not all Christians speak in unknown tongues.
    • The Bible does not teach miracles are for today AND the cessation of miracles.
    • The Bibles does not teach that a believer is different from a Christian or a follower of Christ AND a believer is not a Christian.
    • The Bibles does not teach that one must endure to the end to be saved AND those that are saved will endure.

    There are two important, undeniable, issues with posting anything online: 1) We cannot see each other’s face and 2) we cannot hear how we are sharing our views.

    With the seven statements above that I made, what I am trying to convey is the fact that seven different denominations, for example, cannot state 100% that their doctrines are all biblical if there is division among believers, some of those denominations has to be wrong.

    We have to consider that our cultural, social, educational, spiritual, religious, and even marital status affect our understanding of the Sacred Writings.

    The Assemblies of God Council recognizes that it subjectivizes (subjectively reads) the verses in the Book of Acts in order to establish the doctrine that speaking in unknown tongues is the Initial Physical Evidence of the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. I was born again under the umbrella of the AOG Council and I have never accepted this view and still reject the doctrine of the Pre-Tribulation Rapture. However, I believe that speaking in tongues are still valid and we must see such gift in the light of 1st Corinthians, chapters 12-14.

    It is in the light of other verses that I disagree with the “Once Saved, Always Saved” doctrine.

    In your writing, you differentiate the word “believers” from “Christians”, when in fact that Bible does not make such distinction.
    In your writing, you use the word “condemn” as a synonym of disagreement. I believe Joes Osteen’s theology is unbiblical. However, this is judgment, not condemnation. All Christians judge. However, the issue is whether our judgment is destructive or constructive. When we say that a car is dirty is because we are judging the car against the standard of cleanliness.

    In analyzing your writing, you are mistaken the opposite view of your doctrine. Let me explain what I mean. Unitarians, in trying to debunk the Trinitarian doctrine, accuse Trinitarians that they are preaching three Gods when in fact that is not the case. What the Trinitarian doctrine states is that God is the title of a unit that includes three beings with equal essence, among other things.

    In your belief about salvation that a Christian cannot walk away from God and be lost, if such individual does not repent, you arrived at three incorrect conclusions: 1) such person was never saved, 2) that a person cannot be lost, and 3) that Christians may live in terror if they believe they can be lost after being redeemed, if they do not remain.

    For conclusion #1, please read the whole Book of Jude, the whole Book of James, the whole Book of Hebrews (emphasis on Chapter 6 & 10). If you can read from (exegesis) those texts that saved people cannot walk away from God and be lost forever (IF they do not repent), then I am afraid that one of us is not rightly dividing the Word of Truth. If the warnings (not advisories or cautions) in the Book of Hebrews are hypothetical, then such book has no spiritual significance since, according to the OSAS doctrine, true believers cannot turn their backs on God. In other words, the Holy Spirit wasted His time in inspiring the author of the Book of Hebrews to write what he wrote.

    Jesus said that Satan CANNOT cast out Satan (Matthew 12:22-29). However, in trying to prove the OSAS doctrine to be biblically sound, a subscriber to this doctrine has to say that Judas Iscariot was never a true believer; just a follower of Christ. However, what am I do to with Matthew 10:1-4 where it says that Jesus gave His 12 disciples “authority over unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal every kind of disease and every kind of sickness?” How could Judas, just a follower of Christ (not a believer), do such things?

    For conclusion #2, no one, that I know, who disagrees with the OSAS doctrine, believes that a Christian can lose his/her salvation; what those of us that disagree with this doctrine believe is that a Christian can entangle himself/herself with sin, again, and deceive himself/herself that willfully sinning has no eternal consequences. Paul, writing to Christians in Galatia says in Galatians 5:19-21, “Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions, envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. Please notice that words “forewarn” and “forewarned.” He is writing to people that were undeniably saved but were being bewitched into believing “another” gospel.

    For conclusion #2, there is a difference, even among Southern Baptists, concerning the assurance of salvation and the insurance of salvation. A person that Jesus has redeemed knows very well that an internal transformation took place; they are no longer the same. However, if a newly convert is a baby Christian (novice) then it is logical to believe and to think that a spiritual grows is compulsory in order to become like Christ. Such person can be assured of that God will do anything and everything to bring that person to a spiritual maturity greater than ever before experienced. However, such growth comes because of such person is submitting constantly to the Lordship of Christ and the leading of His Holy Spirit. God does not forsake anyone. However, we can forsake His ways and, if there is no repentance, we can be lost forever.

    Paul says in Philippians 2:12-13 (NASB), “So then, my beloved, just as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your salvation with fear and trembling; for it is God who is at work in you, both to will and to work for His good pleasure.” This passage begs the questions: 1) Fear of what and 2) trembling before what. What was Paul’s concerns?

    There is no such thing as “truly saved” in the Bible. The Exodus Story has a reach theology from which Jesus, Stephen, Paul, and Jude draw a comparison to the salvation under the New Covenant. Since Christians can be deceived (and that was the number one issue for Jesus in Matthew 24:4), what do you suppose could happen is a Christian (believer or follower of Christ) stays deceived?

    The promise that God will never forsake or leave His people is not a new promise under the New Covenant; it was a promise under the Old Covenant. However, God did not put up with their rebellion and destroyed those that did not remain faithful.

    What some Christians want is salvation insurance; though they may sin, they believe they will inherit the Kingdom. The Holy Spirit, though the Apostle Paul, says otherwise. Jesus speaks in John 15 about remaining, as something that He expects believers to do; NOT something Jesus expects will automatically happen. The Church of Laodicea is a great example that Christians can turn lukewarm and God would spit them out of His mouth.

    Hebrews 3:11-113 (NASB) says, “Take care, brethren, that there not be in any one of you an evil, unbelieving heart that falls away from the living God. But encourage one another day after day, as long as it is still called “Today,” so that none of you will be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin.”

    He is speaking to the “brethren” warning them to be careful lest they depart (fall away) from the living God. Paul, writing to Timothy (a believer) writes in 1st Timothy 4:1-3 (NASB), “But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons, by means of the hypocrisy of liars seared in their own conscience as with a branding iron, men who forbid marriage and advocate abstaining from foods which God has created to be gratefully shared in by those who believe and know the truth.”

    Notice that Paul says, “Some will fall away from the faith”, not from a denomination, a movement, an organization, but the faith.

    In order to believe that OSAS is biblically sound, I have to violate the meaning of the texts I quoted and see them as hypothetical, improbable examples that will never materialize because a Christian could never walk away from God.

    By the way, I do not live in terror that I may not enter (inherit) the Kingdom of God but I keep a healthy fear (just as I would for cars) to make sure I am ready to meet my Creator when He comes for me. Paul says to examine whether we are in the faith.

    Blessings!

    • Gordon King

      In response to Eliot Lugo:

      I am making the same point, we are saved or we are not.

      I did not differentiate between Christians and believers, yet I used both interchangeably several times.

      I did not use the word “condemn” as a synonym for disagreement, you stated to me “I believe that the doctrine of “Once Saved, Always Saved” is one of the damnable doctrines that are sending people to hell.” This is not merely disagreement which would be fine, but rather condemnation. Telling me that I am teaching a damnable doctrine. Perhaps you were not meaning to direct it at me, but you did.

      There is much scripture which must be examined very carefully and this is what we must do in prayer. We must allow the Holy Spirit to lead and guide us. I could argue about this subject all day long, but what good would it do? I could write page after page after page supporting what I believe scripture says about our salvation, as you could yourself.

      If I did not sense that what I am saying is the truth then I would not be so passionate about it, and if I did not experience what I have said then I probably wouldn’t either, but I have. And if what Jesus said about being saved is not true then how can anyone believe any of the bible? We would have to assume that there are many contradictions and that much of it is false, which I do not believe for one minute. Anyone can tell me that what I have experienced with God didn’t really happen, but I know otherwise.

      We are either saved or unsaved and the good Lord knows who belongs to Him. Let us agree to disagree. We will all not agree on the same biblical issues, yet if we are saved then we are all God’s children, loved dearly and precious in His eyes.

      God bless! Maranatha!

  2. thelostcoinblog

    Well stated Gordon. God’s plan of redemption has not failed.
    The key is to truly believe in Jesus Christ/Yeshua from the heart. That’s what God sees, cares about, where your heart is. People can hide their true intentions but God sees all. As you pointed out 12 were chosen 11 were converted (change of heart). All sinned, yet all but one reconciled through confession and repentance, upon looking within themselves to trust Him and His word. And isn’t that what our Lord’s message is all about (and the Apostles carried forward), to trust Him and do the Father’s will as He has. To love God above everything and love our neighbor as ourselves…

    We’re all human and at any given time we fall, it’s in our nature but Christ came to redeem us, gives us His Spirit to overcome and to endure, stay steadfast til the end. He didn’t promise a bed of roses but help to conquer the demons inside us, around us. Laying everything at the feet of the cross not just our problems and mistakes but everything the good, the bad and the ugly. Purging ourselves of the baggage we carry inside us, cleansing ourselves to receive, accept forgiveness which gives us peace of mind. While still living in this world we’re set apart from it, showing by example who we stand with. His own knows His voice and trust His word. Scriptures tells us to test all spirits by His word. His words are treasures to our soul and gives us hope. And having a solid relationship with Him is worth all the gold in the world.

    To changed from our old self to a new creation in Christ, wanting to love Him as He has loved/loves us. If one stays in God’s grace, even though we fall (and everyone does, let’s not kid ourselves) that little voice inside us will keep us in check to confess, repent and believe. God is merciful, longsuffering giving everyone a chance to come to Him by their own initiative. The conversion of the heart to trust God above everything else assures us our salvation is eternal.
    God bless everyone to realize just how awesome our God truly is. Maranatha!
    ~SweetJava

    • Gordon King

      Thank you SweetJava!

      Very well stated, nicely said! God knows us, He knows our heart, and He knows who belongs to Him and who doesn’t. We will all make mistakes, we will all sin at times, yet He is merciful and forgiving.

      I believe that there are many people who say that they are true believers in Christ, yet they never really repented of their sins in the first place, they never actually admitted to themselves and to God that they were sinners and that they have sinned. They say that they have accepted Christ but did they really? Only God really knows.

      And this is where I believe that many believers get tripped up with the word of God when it speaks about some of us falling away, of not entering the kingdom of heaven, it is referring to those who never knew God but thought that they did. We must trust that what the good Lord tells us about our eternal salvation is the truth, that if we repent and believe then we shall be saved, that we shall inherit eternal life, and that no one or nothing can snatch us out of His hand!

      God is so awesome, much, much more than we know!

      God bless! Maranatha!

  3. Eliot Lugo

    If Jesus saved a person, we would correctly consider such person saved. However, nowhere in the Bible Jesus, Paul, Peter, Jude, or James teach the perseverance of the saints apart from the responsibility of the believer to abide, to remain faithful to the end.

    It is my understanding that salvation (or redemption) includes justification, sanctification, and glorification.

    To simply believe, “We are either saved or unsaved” is too broad because the Bible does teach that some believers (Christians) will depart from the faith in the last days. Paul said it and I doubt we can re-interpret such saying in a way opposite of what he meant when he wrote what he wrote.

    In reading Jude, for example, pay close attention to verse 1, which reads (NASB), “Jude, a bond-servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to those who are the called, beloved in God the Father, and kept for Jesus Christ.”

    Here is writing to Christians, not pew warmers or churchgoers.

    Verse 3, “Beloved, while I was making every effort to write you about our common salvation, I felt the necessity to write to you appealing that you contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all handed down to the saints.”

    Jude was going to write to his recipients about the “common salvation” they share. However, he felt compelled to write about contending earnestly for the faith. This implies a fight.

    Verse 5 says, “Now I desire to remind you, though you know all things once for all, that the Lord, after saving a people out of the land of Egypt, subsequently destroyed those who did not believe.”

    As a Bible student, one must ask himself/herself why Jude would want to remind his audience about something they already knew. Jude says that the Lord saved the Israelites (all of them) from Egypt, eventually destroying those that did not believe or did not remain faithful. Why would Jude bring an Old Covenant story to a people under a New Covenant, if such story has no relevance in their walk with Christ?

    Jude goes on and on to remind his audience to “keep yourselves in the love of God, waiting anxiously for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ to eternal life.” He uses Cain, Balaam, and Korah as example of rebellious people.

    Reading 2 Peter Chapter 2 in its entirety presents a different picture from the OSAS doctrine some churches preach/teach.

    Verse 2 reads, “But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.”

    Please, take a closer look at the phrase “even denying the Master who bought them.” According to what you said, that we are saved or unsaved, these false prophets were people that, according to Peter, Jesus bought them. If Jesus bought them, then they were saved; there is no way around it. Read the whole chapter, then place close attention to verses 17-22, with emphasis on 20-22.

    Peter states that these false teachers “escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.” However, they became “entangled” once more with the defilements of the world. Then in verse 21, Peter says that “it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them.” A person cannot turn away from the way of righteousness if such person was not in the way of righteousness. To turn (fall) away from the faith, one must be in the faith. When people turn away from the kingdom of darkness, they turn to the Kingdom of Light; there is no limbo or a place in between these two kingdoms. If these people turned away from the way of righteousness, then it is logical to think or believe that they turned to the way of unrighteousness.

    To make the greatest impact with his message, Peter says, “It has happened to them according to the true proverb, “A dog returns to its own vomit,” and, “A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire.” Logically, no one can return to a place he/she has never been before. For a dog to return to its own vomit, the dog must have vomited first. For a sow (pig) to return to the mire, it must have left the mire.

    In the light of Peter, Jude, James, Paul (Romans 11 & 1st Corinthians 10), and the Book of Hebrews, plus the teachings of Jesus about abiding and perseverance, then we must re-interpret these verse giving them foreign interpretations or meaning.

    The Bible does not support the doctrine of Once Saved, Always Saved while at the same time supporting that some Christians will fall away, according to Paul. If the people falling away from the faith were not Christians, then there are different types of Christians: True Christians and False Christians. However, the Bible only speaks of believers, followers of Christ, or Christians.

    It is not an issue of supporting what you or I believe but letting the Scriptures speak for themselves.

    You asked, “And if what Jesus said about being saved is not true then how can anyone believe any of the bible?”

    Since Paul did not preach a different Gospel than the one Jesus preached, let me ask you, “And if what Paul said about being saved is not true then how anyone can believe any of the bible?”

    You stated, “We are either saved or unsaved and the good Lord knows who belongs to Him.” Not only does the good Lord knows who belongs to Him but also according to the Lord Himself, He said that by the fruits we should know them. According to Southern Baptist doctrine, Southern Baptist Christians cannot know which person is a Christian, which goes against what Jesus said about people’s fruits.

  4. Anonymous

    Perfect love casteth out all fear. I know Jesus love for me is unconditional and He has proven Himself to be faithful even when I have not been. I am a work in progress whilst I am in this Body on Earth but it has been completed in Heaven and the Lord sees the finished result! TRANSFORMED into His likeness! I can’t wait until that day when I will see Him face to face!

    Maranatha!
    Christine

    • Gordon King

      Thanks for your comment Christine!

      Amen! His love for us is unconditional, meaning nothing we do or don’t do will separate us from His love. That’s my point, we have been justified by Jesus, we are being sanctified by Jesus also, meaning that it is not of our own doing but God, all God! If it were any other way than we could boast that we have taken a part in our salvation, when Jesus did it all for us. We don’t take a part in our salvation, nor do we take a part in maintaining our salvation by our works, it is a gift from God and all of the glory goes to Him alone!

      God bless! Maranatha!

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  6. Anonymous

    Thank God there are no denominations or high sounding theologians in the bible nor in heaven.

    Ethin

  7. Anonymous

    I agree with you Gordon, If any BORN AGAIN believer should have lost their salvation it should definitely have been be me but that is a very long story spanning the first 10 years of my 40 year walk. However, I can testify to the fact that He never did give up on me and used every circumstance in my backslidden life to turn me around, fully repentant ,contrite and broken in heart ready to make a full surrender to Him as Lord of my life. God’s plan of redemption has not failed nor will it for all the believers who have been born again and are therefore in Him and He is in them. The battle was won at great price!

    He is not just our Creator Who gave us physical life, He is the One Who brings eternal life. Jesus says, “I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in me, though he die, yet shall he live, and everyone who lives and believes in me shall never die” (John 11:25-26). If Jesus says whoever believes in Him has eternal life, but then loses it, did they really have it in the first place? Can you have something that’s eternal and then it ceases to exist? Jesus said “I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand” (John 10:28-29). Who or what could snatch someone out of God’s hands or the mighty hands of Jesus?

    Are those who tasted of the heavenly gift the same as those who received it? Tasting or hearing about “the heavenly gift” is not the same as receiving it. The author of Hebrews conclusion to this chapter doesn’t sound very condemning at all, as he writes, “we are not of those who shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who have faith and preserve their souls” (Heb 10:39). Those who only “tasted [of] the heavenly gift” and have left the fellowship, “went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us” (1st John 2:19). I believe this refers to those that had never been fully converted , I always think when someone tells me they lost there faith , perhaps because of a tragic event in their life that they were not truly converted in the first place because I believe it is impossible to lose your faith once it is in the person of Jesus Christ as He will always testify to Himself when we are in Him and He is in us. He cannot be unfaithful to Himself.!

    “If God is for us, who can be against us” (Rom 8:31), and “Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or danger, or sword” (Rom 8:35)? The Apostle Paul answers his own question by writing, “I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord”(Rom 8:38-39).

    Maranatha!
    Christine

    • Gordon King

      Thanks for your comment Christine!

      Very well stated! God chose us to be His children, we were predestined to be saved, therefore why would He do so, if knowing that we would sin, save us if He were then to take away our salvation? And if it were possible to lose our salvation, then just how much sin must we commit in order to lose it? Just what sin is so bad that we would lose our salvation in the first place?

      There is only one sin spoken of in the bible which says we cannot be saved, the unpardonable sin. And what is that, it is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit of God, in other words rejecting Jesus Christ as your savior, rejecting the gospel of Christ. And if we are saved then we do not have to worry about committing this sin, because we have already accepted Christ.

      We all sin and we all still will, yet we have rest and peace in knowing that God has already forgiven us for “all” of our sins. Therefore we can rest in our salvation knowing that God will never leave us nor forsake us as He has told us. Not every believer believes these things, but I most certainly do! And if God told us these things why would we then not believe Him?

      If we take specific verses of scripture and interpret them to mean that we can lose our salvation, then we are denying many, many other verses which God Himself tells us that we cannot. This represents a contradiction of scripture, unless of course we are not interpreting scripture as it was intended to be interpreted.

      We must all seek the Holy Spirit for wisdom and guidance, for enlightenment of the truth, for interpretation of scripture.

      God bless! Maranatha!

      • Eliot Lugo

        Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit of God is not rejecting Jesus. Read the context in which this sin was committed.

      • Gordon King

        In reply to Eliot Lugo.

        If rejecting Christ is not blasphemy against the Holy Spirit then what is?

        The Pharisees claimed that Jesus was casting out demons by the devil, rejecting Christ as God, they most certainly did! They accused Jesus of having a demonic spirit instead of the Holy Spirit of God, refusing to believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, rejecting Jesus Christ.

        The verse just before Jesus tells us of the unpardonable sin:

        Matthew 12:30
        “He who is not with Me is against Me, and he who does not gather with Me scatters abroad.”

        Jesus Christ is God who is part of a trinity, yet all three are one God. Can a person blaspheme the Holy Spirit and become a Christian? If a person blasphemes the Holy Spirit are they not rejecting Christ as the Pharisees did?

      • Eliot Lugo

        Jesus said that blaspheme against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven. However, Paul said in 1 Timothy 1:12-14 (NASB), “I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who has strengthened me, because He considered me faithful, putting me into service, even though I was formerly a blasphemer and a persecutor and a violent aggressor. Yet I was shown mercy because I acted ignorantly in unbelief; and the grace of our Lord was more than abundant, with the faith and love which are found in Christ Jesus.”

        How then could Paul blaspheme and yet still be saved? The answer lies in the fact that Paul acted ignorantly as opposed to the religious leaders, which attributed the works of the Holy Spirit to the prince of demons.

        Though some Christians believe (and promote) that such sin cannot be committed today, there is no verse in Scripture to accept such view.

        If rejecting Jesus Christ, as you put it, is to blaspheme against the Holy Spirit, then we are in trouble. According to Jesus, there is no forgiveness for this sin. Therefore, if a person rejected Jesus 20 years ago (making him a blasphemer) then he is unable to come to Christ at all and be saved; his fate is sealed because of this sin…according to what you stated.

        John Piper (famous Calvinist), not necessarily a Christian (since being a Calvinist, Baptist, Pentecostal, etc. does not equal being a Christian), believes that Jesus forgives all sins even the blaspheming of the Holy Spirit. If this is true, then Jesus was wrong in saying there is no forgiveness for this sin. John, probably referring to the blaspheming of the Holy Spirit, says (1 John 5:16), “There is a sin that leads to death. I am not saying that you should pray about that.”

      • Gordon King

        In reply to Eliot Lugo.

        If as you have stated, “How then could Paul blaspheme and yet still be saved?” Jesus said those who blaspheme the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, how does one then reconcile this with Paul stating that he did blaspheme, yet he was saved? He said that he blasphemed, but he did not say that he blasphemed the Holy Spirit. Perhaps if a person “ignorantly” blasphemes the Holy Spirit this is forgivable? None of us know for sure, but one day we will!

        And you stated that we must all be in trouble, because we have all blasphemed the Holy Spirit, but Jesus said that you can speak against Him and it will be forgiven, just how many unbelievers even know about the Holy Spirit? I sure didn’t! People blaspheme Jesus Christ everyday, but I never hear them blaspheming the Holy Spirit.

        Apparently you also believe that seals by God can be broken (ie, believers being sealed by the Holy Spirit), so if this is the case then you must also believe that his fate is not really sealed, that it too can be broken.

        And you did not give an answer for what you believe the unpardonable sin is?

      • Eliot Lugo

        I believe the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is attributing to the devil the works of the Holy Spirit. Someone else said that the new blasphemy of the Holy Spirit today is attributing the works of the devil to the Holy Spirit.

    • Eliot Lugo

      You stated, “Are those who tasted of the heavenly gift the same as those who received it? Tasting or hearing about “the heavenly gift” is not the same as receiving it.”

      Logically, a person cannot taste something unless they have received it. Do you agree? It is like eating; you can taste it unless you have it in your possession. The persons spoken of in chapter 6 of the Book of Hebrews were not sinners in the same that they never met the Lord. Remember that the author is writing to Christians. Also, I am not saying that a person can lose his/her salvation (since he/she cannot be unsaved), but that God may deny entrance to the Kingdom of Heaven because he/she departed from the faith. If obedience is a given as something we Christians do and will constantly do, then all those warnings in the Book of Hebrews are just there for no reason whatsoever, even if we conclude that the author is addressing Hebrew Christians.

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